Life at Liberis with Laura Wyglendacz

What’s your name and what do you do at Liberis?

Hi! My name is Laura Wyglendacz. I’m a leader and a technologist. For the past 5-6 years my focus has been building data products.

I’m playing a few different roles at Liberis. My job title is Staff Engineer. Staff+ Engineers are individual contributors. It is a leadership role predicated on broad organisational influence and involvement. Right now I’m also managing Liberis’ data engineers in an interim Head Of role. I’m building relationships with and between teams who produce or consume data. I expect my role and job title will continue to evolve, due to Liberis’ size and lifecycle stage. My personal style is to switch between tactical and strategic modes depending on what’s required. Liberis is in growth mode, scaling up. We need to be agile and innovative to secure our place in the market. I’m helping define and build the sociotechnical* data systems to support this growth.

Sociotechnical: shorthand for the complex interactions between people and organisations, and the infrastructure and software that they build*.**

What makes you proud to work here?

Lots of things! Here are my top 2 so far:

Leaders I respect

• Individual leaders have shown themselves to be vulnerable, approachable, and self-reflective.
• Many of them ‘practice what they preach’ in terms of demonstrating company behaviours. This includes admitting when they fail.
• This is rare in my experience, which makes it all the more notable.

Action-oriented culture

• Meaning is derived from action and behaviour, rather than what the company, or individuals, say they will do.
• This is apparent across the whole business – from PR, to People, to Operations (and beyond!).

What are your stand-out memories of working at Liberis so far?

I have only worked here for 5 months, and from my first day, I have felt welcome. It still FEELS good to work here. In some organisations, friendliness stops after a couple of weeks when your ‘new person’ status wears off, or, it is limited to your functional area.

This is super important to me. As a socially anxious person, I struggle to feel comfortable in new groups. Times of change like starting a new job are nerve-wracking for other reasons too. I’m neurodivergent and upheavals in routine and environment affect me disproportionately. The culture of social inclusion at Liberis has brought me out of my shell and helped me settle in quickly. I feel motivated to pass on that great feeling, by reaching out to connect to others more than I usually would.

I also remember being immediately inspired by people here. Regardless of job title or business function, a curiosity and drive to succeed infuses conversations at Liberis with an energy that I find motivating and exciting.

Since working here, what ways have you developed – personally and/or professionally?

I’m the kind of person who can’t put a wall between the personal and the professional. That is not to say I don’t have boundaries, but anything I spend 8+ hours a day doing would become profoundly personal to me in terms of impact on my whole life. I’ve recently experienced a few difficult years of mental and physical health challenges. The biggest contributing factor was being bullied whilst working somewhere that did not have a well-functioning People team. At Liberis I have a good support network of people and resources already. It is no exaggeration to say that it is healing to work at a company which has already demonstrated how much it values me and cares about my well-being and health.

It will be easier to develop professionally in such an environment – my people management skills are growing fast, and I’m excited about what comes next!

What makes Liberis different from anywhere else you’ve worked?

Liberis is showing strong signs of commitment to inclusion – in deed, not just in word. I have several hidden disabilities, and I’m a woman (yup, still a rarity in tech) – so this is important to me.

I’m 11-12 years into my tech career, and just about everywhere I’ve worked or interviewed at has talked big talk about being inclusive and diverse. Most of those places did not commit to making reasonable adjustments and did not do the work to avoid or challenge discriminatory practices and behaviours, either institutionally or amongst individuals.

Liberis seems different. It has engaged with my identity, my needs and my rights in an authentic and intelligent manner. It is the first place I have worked which acknowledges the urgency and importance of supporting me to be myself and to be well, by listening, learning, and taking action quickly.

What do you look forward to most in Liberis’ future?

I am very excited about seeing the future product opportunities that will be unlocked when Liberis’ investments in event-based architecture and a scalable data platform start to bear fruit.

A Day in the Life of a Marketing Lead with Courtney Yule

What’s your name and what do you do at Liberis and where in the world do you work? 

My name is Courtney Yule, and I’m a Marketing Lead based out of our London office. I work across our marketing for our UK and Ireland partners, responsible for developing and executing creative and data driven marketing campaigns and customer experiences, with a focus on SME acquisition. 

From the moment you wake up in the morning, what do you look forward to for the day ahead? 

I’m lucky that I get to work with a bunch of talented, passionate, and genuinely nice people – so makes the work that we do that much more exciting.  

There’s also genuine interest in your career and development. I’m currently participating in a mentor programme, which pairs you up with a senior employee at Liberis to work on areas of development – so there’s really the opportunity to learn and grow within your role.  

Describe a typical day for you in your role. 

No day is the same! I could be meeting with partners, developing a marketing strategy for a partner or crafting copy for an upcoming campaign. I get to work across a large range of marketing projects – so I get the opportunity to flex different parts of my marketing skillset, whether its creative, analytical, or commercial.  

What advice would you give a colleague whose just joined your team? 

Don’t be afraid to push the boundaries and question things! We’re a fast-moving business and if there’s a better or different way of doing something – everyone is really open to ideas. There’s really no limit to what you can achieve at Liberis if you think outside the box. 

Are you office based, remote or hybrid? What are the pros and cons, if any? 

I’m based in the London office, where I typically work two days from home and three in the office – but really depends on the week! It’s great having the flexibility to work from home if you need a bit of head down time, but we’re quite a social bunch, so it’s nice coming into the office and being able to collaborate with everyone (and go for a well-deserved after work drink!).

Gender & Sex

As part of Liberis’ celebration of Pride month, the DE&I council decided to write about the difference between gender and sex. For many folk who identify as LGBTQIA+, particularly the trans community, the distinction is important. Sex and gender are sometimes used interchangeably, but they have different meanings.

Understanding the terms is a way of showing support for LGBTQIA+ colleagues. It can also help to challenge biased or problematic assumptions about individuals based on their perceived gender or sex.

Here is an infographic that visually describes the differences between the terms sex; gender identity; gender expression (outward presentation), and sexual/emotional attraction.

Sex

Sex is the term used to describe a set of biological attributes in humans, and in other animals. The sex categories are:

• male
• female
• intersex

When babies are born, doctors look at their genitalia and assign sex as male or female. In a small proportion of cases babies are identified as intersex, but often this is not apparent until later in life.

Genitalia are only one biological marker of sex. They are used due to their strong correlation with other sex attributes. Other sex attributes include hormones, internal sexual anatomy, gene expression and so on.

Gender

Sex as a concept applies to all animals. Gender is a human concept. It describes the set of rules, behaviours and expectations that have become associated with girls and women, boys and men in human society. Gender categories are:

• girls/women
• boys/men
• people who don’t conform to one of these may use terms to describe themselves like non-binary, a-gender, genderfluid.

Gender describes how we think about ourselves, how we express and present ourselves, and how we perceive and consider others. It is not always fixed and can change over time for some people.

Normalisation of understanding that gender is a social construct challenges the idea that ‘normal’ is a binary fixed category, and represents normality as a range of combinations of sex, gender identity, gender presentation, and attraction.

Why is the distinction important?

Societal ‘norms’ have typically associated gender closely to sex and seen it as a fixed thing. For example, Female-sexed babies are expected to grow into girls and women who behave in typically ‘feminine’ ways.

Girls falling outside of behavioural norms by choosing to dress or behave like typical boys of the same age are sometimes called ‘tomboys’. The category puts these girls ‘outside the norm’ and often comes with negative connotations. This is an example of gender morning.

Male-sexed babies are typically expected to grow into boys and then men who dress and behave in ways considered typical for their sex.

‘Boys will be boys’, is a common phrase used to normalise boisterous behaviour in male-sexed children – another example of gender norming in action.

These social expectations link biology (sex) closely with behaviour – resulting in the traditional idea that there are normally two fixed options for sex/gender pairing in humans:

• To be biologically male and to identify as, behave and look like a boy/man
• To be biologically female and to identify as, behave and look like a girl/woman

The ‘normal’ expectation that humans fall into one of two categories can be harmful. Societal rules are complex and slow to change, with power and majority being strong influences on what is considered ‘normal’.

Those outside the ‘norm’ are regularly excluded and marginalised for being different. They may act differently to what feels natural to them in order to stay safe and fit in, which is tiring and harmful in of itself.

By understanding the difference between biological sex and societal gender, it is possible to acknowledge that many people do not fit the two binary sex/gender norms described above.

Transgender

Transgender is the term used to describe people who consider their gender identity to be different from the gender typically associated with the sex assigned to them at birth.

The term for people who have the gender identity that matches the norms for the sex assigned to them at birth, is cis gender.

These terms are often abbreviated to ‘trans’ and ‘cis’.

Personal Reflection

I was assigned female at birth, and I think of myself as… a female sexed person! I have never had either a feminine or a binary gender identity. I just don’t think of myself in that way. The words girl and woman don’t resonate with me. On top of that, they make me think of stereotypes that I prefer to avoid. But I’m happy enough to use them because its easier, due to the way I look. Not everyone has that privilege.

My gender is outwardly ‘feminine’ most of the time, because I like to express myself creatively. Colourful nails and fashion are an accessible way to do so every day. It is still easier for women than for men to enjoy fashion and makeup without attracting negative attention.

In the past I have chosen to dress and present in less typically feminine ways, by cutting my hair short and choosing gender neutral clothes, to try to ‘match’ how I felt inside. I’ve also come to realise that this was an unconscious attempt to avoid sexist bias and harassment that I experienced regularly when I was younger. It didn’t really work, and I wasn’t comfortable with how I was presenting.Fortunately as I’ve gotten older, I’ve become comfortable with my gender expression (feminine) not matching my gender identity (?),. How I feel and express myself may change again over time!

Celebrating Pride Month: Spotlight on Barbara Zurawik

Can you briefly introduce yourself?

Hi, my name is Barbara, and I am a part of Customer Ops team at Liberis. I’ve been with company for almost 2 years now. In my free time I’m a dog walker, full time plant mother and travel enthusiast. 😊

How do you educate yourself about the issues faced by the LGBTQIA+ community?

The best way to educate is to have open conversations with people. Reading articles and following people on social media is great for awareness, but to understand issues that the community is facing, I try to engage myself in meetups with LGBTQIA+ community through art and music events.

How do you handle situations where you witness discrimination or bias against the LGBTQIA+ community?

I think a lot of discrimination is caused by ignorance and speaking up is very important in those situations. But let’s not forget that you can’t fight anger with anger, so the best way to challenge this is with education and open communication.

What does being an ally to the LGBTQIA+ community mean to you?

For me personally, it is a responsibility of sharing my knowledge with others, fighting for LGBTQIA+ rights even if nobody from the community is present in the room. And most importantly educating people who are unconsciously biased, and correcting the language used especially when there may be generational and cultural differences.

What advice would you give to someone who wants to be an ally but doesn’t know where to start?

I feel that the biggest value for LGBTQIA+ community is being open to others and acceptance. If you feel like you want to learn more, get more involved or help out, find an event that involves something you’re interested in or organized by the LGBTQIA+ community. Once you get there, everyone will be welcoming and friendly. You will definitely make friends and most likely find ways to get more involved.

Life at Liberis with Max Mckinnon-Evans

What’s your name and what do you do at Liberis?

My name is Max Mckinnon-Evans and I work as a Business Operations Executive.

What makes you proud to work here?

There are lots of reasons to be proud to work here, but I think the one that stands out to me is the people. Liberis has such a range of wildly talented people who put such effort into what they do. It makes the delivery of a project, the launch of a new partner, and the day to day very rewarding knowing how much effort has been poured into work by your colleagues. The culture is supportive, inclusive, and great to be a part of.

What are your stand-out memories of working at Liberis so far?

I have many great memories from the last couple of years but one that stick in my mind would be meeting such a great group of people from different walks of life, the chances I have had to develop professionally, the growth in my personal confidence since working here and the opportunities to own workstreams of my own.

Since working here, what ways have you developed – personally and/or professionally?

I graduated from university during the pandemic and joined Liberis at the tail end of covid restrictions, so all my experience in a full-time role have been here. Initially, I joined Liberis in a customer facing role, and after expressing an interest in business operations I was able to move internally thanks to the support of my manager and the career development framework. In a short space of time, I have been able to work on an incredibly broad range of topics. From supporting our merchants on the ground in my initial role, to working on process improvement, new partner onboarding, and geo expansion in my current one. Liberis has offered me opportunities and allowed me to develop skills which will be invaluable to the rest of my career.

What makes Liberis different from anywhere else you’ve worked?

Since I haven’t really worked in an environment akin to Liberis before, my comparison point here will have to be based on conversations I have with friends of a similar age, and how our experiences starting out in a career vary. A couple of stand out differences I can think of are the opportunities we have at Liberis to own and peruse our personal development. There are numerous chances to get stuck into different work streams and learn new skills, and lots of people willing to support that. A second would be the transparency of our leadership team, who constantly keep us up to date on our mission, goals, what we are doing well, and what we aren’t.

What do you look forward to most in Liberis’ future?

I am looking forward to seeing what we decide to tackle next! The sector Liberis operates in is so dynamic that we often must pivot quickly and respond to the latest industry trends. It makes working here exciting and fast paced, so I am looking forward to seeing what challenges come my way over the next few months and what I can learn from working on them.

Celebrating Pride Month: Spotlight on Adrian Morris

Can you briefly introduce yourself?

I’m Adrian Morris, Customer Operations Associate at Liberis. I’m a massive nerd so my hobbies include gaming, film, comics etc.

Can you share some of your experiences of coming out, if applicable?

The first person I came out to was my drama teacher at the age of 12. I stayed behind after a class and asked to speak to him, and he said of course and asked me what was wrong. I said I think I might be like you. Being the person that he is he looked me dead in the eye and said: “what, fabulous?” I said no that I was gay and burst into tears. He gave me the biggest hug and said I know and also shed a tear. He’s been my rock ever since so glad to have him apart of my life.

How would you describe Liberis’ culture when it comes to diversity and inclusion, specifically towards LGBTQIA+ employees? 

I find the culture here very welcoming. We are encouraged to be who we are no matter who we are. We actively try to celebrate differences which could be people sharing stories, raising awareness, or just having open honest conversations with each other.

What would you say to a new LGBTQIA+ employee joining Liberis? 

Don’t be afraid to be yourself and let your guard down. You will never be judged here for being who you are no matter where you fall on the rainbow or spectrum.

How can allies within Liberis best support the LGBTQIA+ community in the workplace? 

This goes for both in and out of the workplace. Make sure you’re calling out unacceptable behaviour and asking questions if you’re unsure of something. It’s the best way to learn from one another.

How have your experiences as a member of the LGBTQIA+ community shaped your personal relationships and social interactions? 

I always find that queer people tend to find each other in a workplace. Our cultural references and shared stories often are the building blocks for great friendships.

Could you tell us about a personal role model or inspiration that has significantly impacted your journey as an LGBTQIA+ person? 

Apart from the drama teacher I previously mentioned, I’ve always looked up to Sir Ian McKellen. Apart from being an absolute icon, he’s been fighting for gay rights since the beginning. Coming out on TV and speaking about gay rights openly in the media since the 80s, for some this could have killed your career, but it’s never stopped him.

What advice would you give to young LGBTQIA+ individuals who are in the process of understanding their identities? 

Don’t think that your alone. It’s scary coming to terms with your own sexual or gender identity. The feeling of not being able to “fit in” to social norms never really stops but there is a massive community of support just ready to support you. Don’t let external influences get to you. Remain true to yourself and you’ll find your path.

A Day in the Life of an Engineering Manager with Kirsty Luke

What’s your name and what do you do at Liberis and where in the world do you work?

Hi, I’m Kirsty Luke and I’m an Engineering Manager for Liberis in the UK.

From the moment you wake up in the morning, what do you look forward to for the day ahead?

I can’t wait to find out what problems I will be able to help solve today.  I’m very much still a techie and love to get my teeth into puzzles and find solutions to things.

Describe a typical day for you in your role.

I want to say that there’s no “typical day” in my job as it’s so varied.

We work in two-weekly iterations so at the start and end of those I will be joining the team in planning and retrospective sessions.  I meet daily with the team to ensure that everyone is aligned and that there are no blockers that need my help to clear.  We also have separate regular meetings to talk about the things we will be building in the future.  These refinement sessions help us to understand what the solution will look like and identify any potential issues so that we can avoid them.

Another level to my role is working with my team’s Product Manager to look further ahead and plan the team’s roadmap.  We talk regularly with other teams across Liberis to understand how we can best spend our time to make the most progress on our company goals.

Finally, I am also responsible for the line management and personal development of my team.  This means regular one-to-ones, growth conversations and generally being their primary point of call for any support they need.

What do you love most about your job?

The best part of the job is being able to proudly watch as my team show how the things they have built will make our stakeholder’s lives easier.  Whether that’s an internal tool to save our Ops staff time or a new platform feature to enable us to fund more merchants, it always feels good.

What advice would you give a colleague who has just joined your team?

The number one thing is to make sure that you ask questions!  My team is responsible for the systems that integrate with our partners and manage the flow of funds to and from our merchants.  There is a lot of complex logic here, so it’s important that everyone understands the limit of their own knowledge and always seeks to learn more (that includes me!).

Are you office based, remote or hybrid? What are the pros and cons, if any?

I work fully remote and I manage a fully remote team based throughout the UK.  It’s so refreshing to not have to deal with the stress of the daily commute and the noise and distractions of the office.

Some people claim that it’s easier to collaborate in person, but I just don’t think this is true in engineering.  We have great tools for pair programming, group whiteboarding, problem-solving and just general chat and have a strong culture where people aren’t just on their own all day.  I’ve actually found that remote work makes engineering teams more productive.

A Day in the Life of a Head of Underwriting with Jack Regan

What’s your name and what do you do at Liberis and where in the world do you work?

I’m Jack Regan, Head of Underwriting and I’m currently based in London.

From the moment you wake up in the morning, what do you look forward to for the day ahead? 

Working with both the underwriters and wider team to figure out how we can support small businesses in both their immediate and long-term future. In the current economic climate, it is naturally difficult for small business’ so working for a business that truly cares about supporting SMEs in an area of the business where we are lucky to interact directly with these customers, understand their needs and then from that work through the difficult balancing act of offering solutions to these customers whilst also protecting Liberis’ future is a challenging but hugely rewarding part of my role.

Describe a typical day for you in your role. 

A typical day for me involves digging into our customer applications, looking to understand if there are any common themes emerging that mean we need to change our decision strategy. On top of that, I’ll regularly spend time providing second opinions for the underwriters on high-value or complex applications, dedicating time to remotely supporting my team that are based in the US and putting together memos that enable us to ensure we are comfortable from a risk perspective with new partner/product launches as well as changes to our existing underwriting approach.

What do you love most about your job? 

They haven’t paid me to say this, but I’d have to say it is working with the underwriting team. I’ve been on a similar journey to all of them, so to watch them all develop and bring such a consistently positive attitude to their role brings a great deal of satisfaction and pride to my job. We’ll as a team always go out for lunch together once a week, and I love that we have such a close-knit relationship.

What advice would you give a colleague whose just joined your team? 

Don’t be afraid to think outside of the box. What I love most about how we underwrite at Liberis is that there is no one size fits all approach. We treat every application on its own individual merits, and with that on every application, we look to provide a tailored solution that will enable our customers to thrive; we are always looking to improve how we decision and, often, a fresh pair of eyes can bring some great ideas that we may have missed.

Are you office based, remote or hybrid? What are the pros and cons, if any?

I’m currently hybrid, travelling into the London office twice a week and working from home in Northampton the other three. For me personally, this gives me a perfect balance of in-person catch-ups, and social time with my colleagues through things like weekly football as well as meaning I get lots of quality time at home with my wife and three kids. It can be tiring on commuting days, particularly if traffic is bad. Still, my manager has been incredibly supportive, and it also means I get to avoid sharing the responsibility of the dreaded school run!

Life at Liberis with Tom Taylor

What’s your name and what do you do at Liberis?

My name is Tom Taylor and I’m the Head of Analytics at Liberis.

What makes you proud to work here?

It’s a great product that serves merchants well and supports businesses that aren’t being adequately supported by the banks. I’m also surrounded by great people – all pushing for the success of the business and our customers.

What are your stand-out memories of working at Liberis so far?

I think the biggest and most obvious memories are how the business reacted to the start of the pandemic and the onset of lockdowns across the countries we serve. That process where we had to essentially change the entire business overnight and where we were suddenly operating in a completely different environment was an amazing thing to play a part in – and a testament to the quality of the people, the business, and the actions we took, that we were able to support our customer base so effectively during that time.

Since working here, what ways have you developed – personally and/or professionally?

I joined Liberis 5 years ago as a first-rung analyst – so pretty much the entirety of my professional skillset has been developed here! I’ve had the opportunity to grow with the business and benefit from those tailwinds, which has played a massive part in my development across the board.

What makes Liberis different from anywhere else you’ve worked?

Great people who desire to push forward and do a fundamentally great job – coupled with a lack of bureaucracy + heaps of trust from senior management mean it’s very easy to be effective here.

What do you look forward to most in Liberis’ future?

The point at which we become the dominant player in the SME funding business..!

A Day in the Life of a Customer Operations Executive with Dillon Green

What’s your name, what do you do at Liberis and where in the world do you work?

Hi, I’m Dillon, and I work in the Customer Operations team based in London.

Our goal is to provide a first-class service to our Partners and Customers. The Customer relationship is passed on to us by the Sales team, and our task is to onboard our customers as quickly as possible as well as to fund them without complications in cooperation with the Sales, Underwriting and Finance teams.

From the moment you wake up in the morning, what do you look forward to for the day ahead?

I look forward to funding as many new and existing applications so as a team we can hit the required targets. In addition, so we can deliver an efficient and quality service to all our customers and in doing so have a positive impact on their business.

Describe a typical day for you in your role. 

A typical day for me would be working on the funding aspects, receiving new applications from the Sales team, ensuring all required checks are performed before the funds get disbursed. I will also contact the customer for additional documents and perform credit checks.  Once the application is approved and the finance agreement is sent, I will contact the customer to provide them with the good news and provide them with the timescale for funding once the agreement is signed.

Throughout the day I would also answer inbound calls and emails from both new and existing customers. I would deal with everything from general queries, complaints, statement requests, contracts and payment queries and change of entities or providers. The queries can vary each day so we aim to identify any trends there might be and make sure all customer facing teams are aware to avoid an influx of the same query.

What advice would you give a colleague whose just joined your team?

I would say don’t put too much pressure on yourself. Take it day by day while adapting to your new working environment and role. Reach out to any team member and ask as many questions as possible.

Are you office based, remote or hybrid? What are the pros and cons, if any?

Hybrid – I work three days from the office and two remotely. Pros of working from home is that it provides great flexibility and there are very few distractions. However, a con with remote working is that your unable to approach any colleague whenever you want to discuss something.

Life at Liberis with Vino Vamadevan

What’s your name and what do you do at Liberis?

My name is Vino Vamadevan and I’m the Director of Compliance.

What makes you proud to work here?

I have always thought a great place to work centres around the people, and this comes in 3 key areas – my colleagues, our customers, and our partners! I have great interactions with my colleagues and we try and collaboratively fix common problems – from top to bottom, regardless of seniority, job titles etc. there are no egos! Our customers are another important aspect of this, having the ability to help through business finance to support their needs whether that that means resolving cashflow problems, recruiting staff, or expanding; from a compliance perspective, that means truly putting customers at the heart of everything we do. The final piece of the puzzle is our partners and working together to realise our common goal of providing businesses with access to finance.

What are your stand-out memories of working at Liberis so far?

I have several good memories from the last 2 years – It ranges from setting up the compliance team, looking at different ways we can support customers, making sure we are monitoring our key controls. However, for me a standout memory has been the awareness and educational pieces of work – whether it’s Treating Customer Fairly Week – which included quizzes, prizes, and cakes (cakes from our TCF themed Liberis Bake Off) or the FinCrime Week which included the infamous FinCrime Rap including members of legal and compliance team. This was a standout achievement because it’s crucial to make key regulatory matters engaging but also add a bit fun.  Compliance doesn’t have to be boring!

 Since working here, what ways have you developed – personally and/or professionally?

I love the fact we are operating across multiple jurisdictions – UK, EU and US. As someone working in compliance this helps me develop regulatory understanding and nuances across these regions. I have also developed how we respond to business stakeholders and holding the compliance team accountable to strict deadlines.

What makes Liberis different from anywhere else you’ve worked?

As a business, Liberis has a great opportunity to scale the business on a couple of fronts which is both interesting and different to the other financial services businesses that I have worked at. Firstly, we have great opportunity to work with great partners and support their merchants with access to business finance. Secondly, there’s a great opportunity to work in different markets and develop regional differences and approaches.

What do you look forward to most in Liberis’ future?

To continue enabling SMEs to access much needed finance to grow and make our embedded finance solution available to more SMEs both in existing regions and expanding into new geographies. Working in compliance, I look forward to making sure we have the right compliance strategy and framework to help achieve this to make sure our customers get good outcomes – that’s through onboarding and in life management.